Hard work and love was put into its creation.. Even if it's a badly designed level, it still deserves that fame, or infamy.. Plus, if the criticism is good, other level creators can glean some good criticism from it too~
The point where we made too many extreme demons was felt for me back all the way in 2019-2020. Man the hardest levels used to be so special. So many bland extreme demons exist now and it’s so sad.
Lots of projects that have been in the works for years are coming soon, we got Heliopolis, APT, AtH, Tidal Wave and more to come, some of them like RUTHLESS, Limbo, EoD or KOCMOC are already out. I feel like after Acheron, the era of bland levels started dying out and a lot of original levels are starting to come out, so my hopes are up for the future of the demonlist
Thats what happen when you get no update while the player is very competitive, making everything frame perfect while back then its a speed of adapting to new content like new gamemode or new trigger and you cant cap the skill because the next update would be releasing new content again
the reason i added fixed hitboxes is because of the layering of the level i couldn’t be bothered to actually select each individual spike and move it up let alone all the structuring for said spike so i just added fixed hitboxes (i also love fixed hitboxes they are so funny)
The version electro gave me to verify was really fun, so disappointing to see a potentially great level ruined because some guy wanted his name on a top 1
@@randomidiot_0 I don't think zoink fucked it up on purpose just so it could be a top 1. there's only so much buffing you can do to make an easier level a top 1, and it seems like he was instructed to do it by the hosts
@@NobodyEverExisted Well, it probably would've been way too much work to actually move the structures closer together to make tighter gaps. As seen in the video, plenty of the parts are entirely on one layer.
IMO, the problems we see with the GD community and what gets popular versus what doesn't is really just reflective of the ENTIRE art and internet worlds as a whole. In general, the types of art that get the most popular are the most formulaic and generic, because the most influential art promoters are trying to make an income from their promotions and thus must cater to what will capture the largest audience, which will (obviously) tend to be art that appeals to the most people, which is almost always the most mainstream stuff. A very clear example of this is music; over the past decades, the pop genre has become increasingly samey and boiled down, because its entire shtick is being _popular,_ and pop consistently dominates the charts. The same thing can be seen on RUclips as a whole. What rises to the top is what brings in the largest audience, which is why seemingly everyone is copying MrBeast nowadays, because his video style gets a shit load of clicks. With Geometry Dash, the same exact problem is what causes mind-numbing shorts, trash top one layouts, and generally formulaic levels to be the most prevalent on showcase channels. Good video, I enjoyed it quite a bit! Just wanted to say that I think these problems we see with our community are reflective of a much, _much_ larger trend.
Hey guys! i wanted to use this pinned comment to talk about the last community post I made and the future of the channel since I seemed to scare a few people about me quitting which I'll explain here. To start, No I'm not quitting. I posted the community post during a pretty shit time because I was really demotivated with RUclips, I recently started school again and this year has been hard for me. Harder classes along with driving school taking up nearly all of my time during the day are to blame for the community post that I made because I was not in a good state of mind to focus on RUclips. But I don't think I'll ever go to the extent of quitting, making RUclips videos is pretty much the only hobby of mine that is productive and I've been doing for so long that I think it would be pretty hard for me just to up and quit without a big goodbye video or anything. I'm going to make RUclips videos until I die most likely so don't worry about me quitting or anything. But with the future of the channel in mind, I do think I might want to slow down. School is shit, I have some of the hardest classes in school and the highest expectations to meet from my parents so most of my time is still going to school. I'll still be able to make videos but maybe not at the pace I once was. I don't want videos to take two months (like this one did) but I also don't know if videos could come out every month like I've intended for a while now. Still IDK about the future till it's the present. I plan to do a stream next week if I have the time but other than that idrk about a whole lot of what's going to happen. Still I am so thankful for your support and will try not to disappoint. Love you all.
Damn, just read all that… I know how it feels to be pressured from very high expectations by everyone, especially from teachers and family. Seeing how well-formed your recent videos are, I see that you do your very best to satisfy others’ expectations. Just know that we’re very satisfied with what you make on YT, and if you need to take a break to focus on IRL stuff, we understand, we support you!! Your videos are amazing, and I don’t want you feeling burned out from everyone while making these videos. I don’t mind whatever decisions you make to help you feel better, so take good care of yourself, k?
sheesh kai 19:44 i think being passionate about anything is a thousand times better than being "business oriented" or just being obsessed with the money
@@thatsguy1111 true like the spider challenge video was actually kind of enjoyable and the bloodbath vid was also good. He just became unoriginal really fast sad.
First video I saw from you, definitely won't be the last. I know that there are a lot of "dissing avernus videos", but yours expanded past just the level itself, and instead talked more about the community as a whole. I gotta say man, this was a W video. :)
I personally think the Avernus Situation is kinda like the reverse of Xanii's Silent Circles situation, where instead of the level becoming too easy to live up to the original's legacy and get rated to place in the Demonlist top 10, the level became too annoyingly hard (not just hard, that would technically make Zodiac hated) to the point of being unfun. (Xanii isn't the host of SiCi, i just don't want to mention the actual host and cause drama)
@@AustynLZodiac is mostly appreciated, especially since it was the last top 1 before the hell/edgy themed top 1's took over, gameplay wise it's veeeery split, some people like it and some people hate it
@@imarandomperson761i feel the song is kinda too boring to be put in the level like the vibe doesn’t suit the difficulty not saying the song sucks bc it sounds great but for a top 1 probably not a song to put in
@@staringcorgi6475 Well it's not as intense as other songs we had in top 1's but it does the job imo, the build up to the last drop starts at ~65% so that's where the intensity settles in, and since the level is over 3 minutes long it's still over a minute of gameplay left
imo even after getting 79 atm my enjoyment rating is a 9/10 most fixed hitboxes from an outside perspective may seem really bad but they really (take this from someone who has 79) dont make that big of a difference. this is just my opinion i think avernus is a really good level even tho the creation process was scuffed and wasnt properly done
Ye I see people complaining how the fixed hitboxes would make it annoying and unnatural to play but it doesn't really matter when you're playing the hardest demon in the game, you'd have already found a way to get consistentat those parts.
I really agree and I love it when these really true videos come to me. It's a fact that is very sad for all creators that the only thing this community wants is just the same copies of the levels keep uploading everyday, It's common for creators to feel the pressure of trying to do something unique and end up giving in to that community pressure and failing miserably because of it. It's a shame, that even entire servers can hate you just for being or creating something different, not because you want difficulty, or want the best decoration of all. But, just making for your own, promotes creativity and the art of expressing yourself and expressing something you like. But the community isn't like that, it hates you for being different, and until you stop it it won't stop chasing you until the end. But don't give in to them, Don't stop for them, because unfortunately, listening to this part of the community unfortunately becomes a failure, a really bad failure. The only thing we can do is depend on ourselves, because wanting attention from this community will lead you to failure and being ridiculed as the creator of Avernus.
Really amazing video! I like the fact that you went into so much detail elaborating how Avernus was lazy and unfun rather than just outright stating it and ending the video.
i thought this was going to be another video just putting down and bashing in avernus for being bad, but the end of the video really opened my eyes to how the gd community functions and how it needs to change. great video!
I’m really glad we’re seeing a shift in the popularity of GD levels. Gone are the days of Bloodbath and Sonic Wave where the hardest levels get all the attention. Some of the most hype I’ve seen for levels recently have been for impressive non-list levels like Abel, Change of Scene, Floating Outskirts, and most recently Spu7nix’s What. Seriously, if there’s any level that makes me go “…What?” It’s What.
I was away from this community for years and I came back coincidentally when avernus was getting beaten up by the community. My first thought seeing the level with the song and theme is that 'Oh a sequel to GgB0y's infernal abyss' not the golden lmao
The biggest failure as a community is the pressure on Rob to rate levels just because they're difficult. Maybe we would have another layer of quality control for gameplay and decoration/optimization if Rob actually looked at the level like he would look at any other level instead of "oooooh, new top 10 extreme demon". Sadly, I think this is something Rob used to do with levels like Wcropolix, Crimson Planet, and Thinking Space but I think the backlash Rob got for not rating Crimson Planet when it was a top 1 has made it so that he rates nearly any new extreme demon verification. Sakupen Circles and Silent Clubstep are objectively bad levels but they didn't have any trouble getting rated like they might have used to.
The hitboes are pockewindfish's fault. Zoink was forced to buff the level, but everything is on the same layer. insead of ruining the decoration, and preserved it and buffed it by fixing the hitboxes.
peak demon list (imo) was either with Zodiac as top 1 or with the top 4 being Tartarus, The Golden, Zodiac, Kenos, Crimson Planet. There's something so iconic about those versions of the list and i cant quite put my finger on what it is
"the list was made for levels, now levels are made for the list" is very insightful and really sums up how the community has started putting too much value on difficulty. good vid
Can I just say how well editted this video is. It has perfect consistency with its subjects, makes good points, and overall has amazing editting. You earned a sub!
your rant on how the community doesnt like unique stuff honestly kinda hits becuase in a way i feel like all my ideas for levels are very derivative, the 2 levels ive spent the most time on are an old slaughterhouse remake and a sonic wave inspired level, both 1.9 styled. it really says something about my creativity that my 2 favorite types of levels are hell levels and circles levels
To think a level like this would represent the GD community as a whole. Thanks so much for making this video. Not only is the effort awesome, but I finally held a full grasp about my personal view on the GD community in general thanks to the many points you created throughout the video! Honestly, I’m even more motivated to keep going as a GD player because of this. Thanks!!! :D
Man, this video is so well made! You really feel like the Emplemon of GD (I realised at 17:56 lmao), because you take a popular topic and put an interesting spin on it that ends up meaning more than the sum of its parts. Keep it up man, you could easily be one of the greats!
At this point i take back anything I may have said about zoink and I hold my head in shame. It wasnt his fault, he was INSTRUCTED TO MAKE IT INTO A BAD LEVEL. Also doesnt matter if you have an RTX 4090 or a GTX 1050 2GB, they will run GD the same, unless the CPU's single core is better (13700K is about 2x faster performance per watt over my old 8700K @95W max)
17:56 We both like Emplemon's editing style huh. (I know the rest of the video has it's own editing style I just liked this moment. I think it was the simpsons, the song, the text popping up to the song, and the light on the individual simpson character)
Amazing video, i really enjoyed watching this, i totally agree that a level should be something that you enjoy making and that you make for the sake of yourself and the community, not something you make as a chore. just to get some popularity. I think that avernus should have just stayed as a top 20 and shouldnt have been horribly buffed, the level woul have been probably liked a lot more. (Also, TroyPM Fun Times)
I love this video. It has amazing editing, great pacing, and was the first time I learned about the history of this level (Pockewindfish is an alt account? It was made by half the same creators as “The Golden”?) It doesn’t feel good to be part of a community that allows such problems to persist, but we need to self-reflect to solve them.
i expected this to be another rant video that i click off in 2 minutes, but this was actually such a high quality video! the pacing is great, the parts all felt necessary, the history was interesting and felt well-researched, didn't feel extremely biased, overall a fantastic vid
"the list was made for levels,now the levels are made for the list" WHAT DID Y'ALL EXPECT? People push the limits, that's why levels are made for the list.
Speaking genuinely, this is such a well made video, highlighting everything wrong with a level and explaining i proper detail how it came to be. Looking forward to your future videos.
if the fact of the fixed hitboxes is a problem, then the REAL problem is how INCONSISTENT THE FIXED HITBOXES ARE. like some of them are shifted , making them harder than other spikes! utter cancer
just randomly found this video on my recommended page and thought it was gonna be the same thing the other 50 "why avernus sucks" videos already said, but it actually said some valid points. nice video man! keep it up!
no one who can't beat the level can't comment on the gameplay, and no one who cant decorate anywhere close to how well the decorators of the level can, cant comment on the deco
17:15 I can tell you right now, the youtube presence of GD hasn't been about the best and brightest levels since probably around when sea1997 made a few videos on ToshDeluxe.
I feel ever since slaughter house or spaceuk confessing, the extreme demon list has just deteriorated. I feel like the only people who can revive it now is Riot and all the og creators. Imagine, a level with riot, dorabae, Cody, darned and zobros. It would be sooo iconic.
If you want attention in the gd community, go in another list. Memory levels. 2p levels. Impossible levels. You can change the Geometry dash community!
You forgot to mension that another reason that avernus is hated is because of Pockewindfish, he has been very controversial because of him insulting and threatening people that dislike the level or saying that it is easier than acheron. Anyway, good video
ive tried my hardest to like this level for what it is but you just proved to me that Avernus is objectively bad. also really agree with your stance on the community, things really need to change. also you’re a very underrated creator, i was surprised with the level of quality and editing! keep making videos like this man
It feels like the community is splitting. One side is going to kaiguy’s argument, which has a lot of children, and the other to fnm04’s argument. Passion projects like anathema, hbfs, white space, requiem, etc. still exist and are arguably growing, but also people who just want to make quick profit of stats, money, or whatever, like that yunhaseo guy or kaiguy are too. Its just now the divide is growing stronger, so people are finally beginning to comment on it.
This was a really good video! I thought the editing was really tight and the pacing of the script was phenomenal. Your voiceover of said script was very convincing too, the only reason I assume it was scripted at all is because of the quality. The EmpLemon influence is strong and noticeable, and I think you managed to incorporate elements of his style while remaining unique very well.
Just separate the demon list into 3 different columns. Hardest , most enjoyable/fun , and best looking/atmosphere, this way players/creators can vote on each aspect of a demon separately. To take it a step further , you could add a 4th column that takes into account of all 3 rankings, ideally putting more weight on the enjoyment/look on a level instead of its difficulty, giving it a general overview for anyone that wants to play it
Avernus would be 2 in difficulty but will most likely not even crack top 150 on the other 2 columns , thus not even sniffing the top 150 of the overall rating of the level. This way the list is fixed and the community would get an easier overview of which levels they want to play/talk about
@@Conorator not necessarily, some people enjoy the challenge and get some fun out of it , but some levels have atrocious gameplay making it harder than it has to be.
Tidal wave is basically what happened with avernus but worse, so bad that the level didn't even get rated. I don't know what happened but I truly love that level, seems like the community doesn't.
this video has my thoughts exactly, especially the stuff about how people like kaiguy and creators of all these extreme demons made to be impossibly hard are just doing it for attention and its making the community worse as a whole
great video, id just like to add something. iirc doggie never dropped avernus, he literally had no idea as to what was happening with it up until when zoink said that he was verifying it. this means that the hosts basically stole the level from doggie after a full year of him expecting to verify it
You are the far less passive aggressive version of Stormfly, and you have my utmost respect for that. Amazing analysis video. You're true about the fact that the complete lack of originality and charm is the true reason why Avernus is a complete dumpsterfire.
About the lags - GPU doesn't really affect the game. If you have an i5-13900 and like some geforce 210, it will most likely be enough for you to run something around Limbo objects count just fine. The GPU is just not used by the game, all calculations are done by one thread of CPU. That's why people say about poor game optimization.
I've been in this community for a long time and I find it funny how the mentality shifted, people used to long for a top 1 that lasted without victors for as long as Bloodbath did, now it's happening and people don't like it, isn't that exactly what yall wanted? It's all in the presentation nowadays, bloodbath felt epic and like an entire community's efforts towards the completion of a single level, avernus feels like just another red top 1 verified in a week
funny tho that like every victor has enjoyed the level tho. i dont get why people talk about a levels gameplay when they arent good enough to play it. the levels clearly doing something right if all victors enjoyed it
I originally liked the Avernus design because even though it looks messy, but it is messy throughout the whole level. But... 11:50 Having a whole part in a single layer is stupid like who would do that
Good stuff! Really accurate and entertainig video. I just want to say some things: The demonlist doesn't really deserve any bit of hate, their job is just ranking the thardest rated demons in the servers, no matter quality, no matter how bad, unfair dogshit is, if it was legit verified and rated, it would be placed. About of the Avernus deco, i don't think is that bad, even if i don't like it that much i think it's really good, it's just really risky. Take in mind this is a HELL THEMED LEVEL, it looks unique aff taking in mind Avernus theme. It's really atmospheric and as a The Golden's antagonist, is really well executed. Keep up the good work! :]
Guys gameplay wise there's also Silent Clubstep. The level looks cool but there are too many fixed hitboxes. Its not like any of us can pass the first jump 99% of the time in the top 10 demons either.
you are one of the most articulate, reasonable, passionate speakers i've ever seen in this game's community. i'm a veteran player, i've been playing since i first downloaded the game on my ipod touch in late 1.9. i've watched this game grow from a place where creativity was valued to a place where constantly-inflating rate standards and an increasingly toxic, entitled community have condensed this game from a beautiful, fun, artistic community into "iSpyWithMyLittleEye VS Change Of Scene 5 LEVELS OF DIFFICULTY $10000 #shorts". in fact, i recently conducted an experiment to see if a shitpost youtube short could get attention immediately just by featuring GD, and it did. avernus is simply a benchmark of a deep poison within this playerbase, and here's hoping that 2.2 will return us to our wide-eyed curiosity and awkward implementations of new update features like back in 2.0
I love that people call this level bland and constantly call to mind the fixed hitboxes.. Does that not describe Tartarus? There are so many top demons that were lazily made, little to no effort. I think the level looks good. The hate it receives is truly unjust in my opinion. I don't understand what everyone has against it.
i cant say anything about avernus, but tartarus doesnt have any sections that are made less fun because of the fixed hitboxes. Also its in like three spots, the entire predrop on avernus is fixed.
This video went from "this level sucks" to "frick the demon list" to "this is the worst game community" to "I actually wish we liked this level" back to "this level sucks"
I used to be part of the gd community, the obsession with top one's and challenges just got boring, also the gatekeeping too, people think if your hardest isn't top 100 or something, you're bad.
![How to get the SECRET ENDING in The Tower (Geometry Dash 2.2) [April Fools]](/img/1.gif)
now its top one lol
Ya lmao
"Avernus might possibly be(it is) the worst top 1 we've had in this game's nearly 10 year history"
Well there had to be at least one more nuke dropped on the community before 2.2 comes out I guess
which is an oof
What a plot twist, indeed.
The fact that it's been 6 months and only one person has even got halfway through this level is just insane lol
why’d you tweet my video lol
@@TroyPM That line goes crazy hard, its the perfect explanation of modern GD
Oh mah gawd it's vortrox
I thought it best 😊
When did I tyoe this
5th reply lol
ironically, it was a good antagonist to the golden. the golden was a popular, natural, and fun experience. avernus is the opposite in all of that
it is popular but in a bad way
I guess that is the reason why they decided to call it "antagonist" than sequel later
LMAO FACTS
Genius
how is the golden considered good?
You unironically gave avernus a reputation and identity
Hard work and love was put into its creation.. Even if it's a badly designed level, it still deserves that fame, or infamy.. Plus, if the criticism is good, other level creators can glean some good criticism from it too~
@@snowarmth gonna have to go with infamy on that one
@@snowarmth the host is most likely 5 years old
@@petrikhorr wouldnt they be wondering why the moon follow them and play with paper airplanes?
@@snowarmth waffling
The point where we made too many extreme demons was felt for me back all the way in 2019-2020. Man the hardest levels used to be so special. So many bland extreme demons exist now and it’s so sad.
so true, i also feel that way right now!
Thats true, but I feel like for every 10 bland list demons, there's one or two that just blow me away in terms of quality.
Lots of projects that have been in the works for years are coming soon, we got Heliopolis, APT, AtH, Tidal Wave and more to come, some of them like RUTHLESS, Limbo, EoD or KOCMOC are already out. I feel like after Acheron, the era of bland levels started dying out and a lot of original levels are starting to come out, so my hopes are up for the future of the demonlist
Thats what happen when you get no update while the player is very competitive, making everything frame perfect while back then its a speed of adapting to new content like new gamemode or new trigger and you cant cap the skill because the next update would be releasing new content again
yeah, and before, almost every level was original and blew ppl away, idiot@@camacakegd3714
the reason i added fixed hitboxes is because of the layering of the level i couldn’t be bothered to actually select each individual spike and move it up let alone all the structuring for said spike so i just added fixed hitboxes (i also love fixed hitboxes they are so funny)
zoink, why did you ruin avernus with the horrible horrible gameplay?? ruining muscle memory smh..
ehehe, fixed hitboxes silly :3
The level sucked already lol it didn’t do that much to ruin it more than it already was
I think it's funny zoink is just a funny Goober gd man
He knew it would be hard for anyone else to beat it which i think is the main reason he did it
Yeah this video sucks why do people expect a level harder than silent club step and potentially Acheron to be fun?
The version electro gave me to verify was really fun, so disappointing to see a potentially great level ruined because some guy wanted his name on a top 1
Well his name is already on a top 1, and it’s going to also be on the next top 1 as well, so his name is actually going to be on the entire top 3
@@smallxplosion9546 I think he meant pockewindfish or the other hosts
@@randomidiot_0 I don't think zoink fucked it up on purpose just so it could be a top 1. there's only so much buffing you can do to make an easier level a top 1, and it seems like he was instructed to do it by the hosts
@@YaBoiSneedManThe only problem is he botched it. The fixed Hitboxes were not that good
@@NobodyEverExisted Well, it probably would've been way too much work to actually move the structures closer together to make tighter gaps. As seen in the video, plenty of the parts are entirely on one layer.
IMO, the problems we see with the GD community and what gets popular versus what doesn't is really just reflective of the ENTIRE art and internet worlds as a whole. In general, the types of art that get the most popular are the most formulaic and generic, because the most influential art promoters are trying to make an income from their promotions and thus must cater to what will capture the largest audience, which will (obviously) tend to be art that appeals to the most people, which is almost always the most mainstream stuff. A very clear example of this is music; over the past decades, the pop genre has become increasingly samey and boiled down, because its entire shtick is being _popular,_ and pop consistently dominates the charts. The same thing can be seen on RUclips as a whole. What rises to the top is what brings in the largest audience, which is why seemingly everyone is copying MrBeast nowadays, because his video style gets a shit load of clicks. With Geometry Dash, the same exact problem is what causes mind-numbing shorts, trash top one layouts, and generally formulaic levels to be the most prevalent on showcase channels. Good video, I enjoyed it quite a bit! Just wanted to say that I think these problems we see with our community are reflective of a much, _much_ larger trend.
One of the best GD related comments ive ever seen
This was a very insightful comment
Ayyyy 69 likes
Not reading allat
nerd
Hey guys! i wanted to use this pinned comment to talk about the last community post I made and the future of the channel since I seemed to scare a few people about me quitting which I'll explain here. To start, No I'm not quitting. I posted the community post during a pretty shit time because I was really demotivated with RUclips, I recently started school again and this year has been hard for me. Harder classes along with driving school taking up nearly all of my time during the day are to blame for the community post that I made because I was not in a good state of mind to focus on RUclips. But I don't think I'll ever go to the extent of quitting, making RUclips videos is pretty much the only hobby of mine that is productive and I've been doing for so long that I think it would be pretty hard for me just to up and quit without a big goodbye video or anything. I'm going to make RUclips videos until I die most likely so don't worry about me quitting or anything. But with the future of the channel in mind, I do think I might want to slow down. School is shit, I have some of the hardest classes in school and the highest expectations to meet from my parents so most of my time is still going to school. I'll still be able to make videos but maybe not at the pace I once was. I don't want videos to take two months (like this one did) but I also don't know if videos could come out every month like I've intended for a while now. Still IDK about the future till it's the present. I plan to do a stream next week if I have the time but other than that idrk about a whole lot of what's going to happen. Still I am so thankful for your support and will try not to disappoint. Love you all.
I feel ya ( i don't make youtube video but damn it's hard sometimes)
the tl;dr is he is demotivated and school is stressful and he won’t be quitting, you’re welcome.
Damn, just read all that… I know how it feels to be pressured from very high expectations by everyone, especially from teachers and family. Seeing how well-formed your recent videos are, I see that you do your very best to satisfy others’ expectations. Just know that we’re very satisfied with what you make on YT, and if you need to take a break to focus on IRL stuff, we understand, we support you!! Your videos are amazing, and I don’t want you feeling burned out from everyone while making these videos. I don’t mind whatever decisions you make to help you feel better, so take good care of yourself, k?
Ik this has nothing to do with the vid 😂 but Der Eisendrache better
@@addressingrandomperson4150 the tl;dr is above
Update: TDiamond (1st victor) and Trick (2nd victor) have beaten Avernus, both in 2024.
sheesh kai 19:44 i think being passionate about anything is a thousand times better than being "business oriented" or just being obsessed with the money
Kaiguy having more subs then Nexus is disgusting
True tbh
WHY???????
@@Obama3ryk because his "content" is just bad
@@asbfgh
Its really sad cause from what I remember, his old content was actually somewhat enjoyable. Now it’s just unoriginal slop.
@@thatsguy1111 true like the spider challenge video was actually kind of enjoyable and the bloodbath vid was also good. He just became unoriginal really fast sad.
First video I saw from you, definitely won't be the last. I know that there are a lot of "dissing avernus videos", but yours expanded past just the level itself, and instead talked more about the community as a whole. I gotta say man, this was a W video. :)
Definitely a W video from TroyPM!
I personally think the Avernus Situation is kinda like the reverse of Xanii's Silent Circles situation, where instead of the level becoming too easy to live up to the original's legacy and get rated to place in the Demonlist top 10, the level became too annoyingly hard (not just hard, that would technically make Zodiac hated) to the point of being unfun. (Xanii isn't the host of SiCi, i just don't want to mention the actual host and cause drama)
i thought zodiac was hated
@@AustynLZodiac is mostly appreciated, especially since it was the last top 1 before the hell/edgy themed top 1's took over, gameplay wise it's veeeery split, some people like it and some people hate it
@@imarandomperson761i feel the song is kinda too boring to be put in the level like the vibe doesn’t suit the difficulty not saying the song sucks bc it sounds great but for a top 1 probably not a song to put in
@@staringcorgi6475 Well it's not as intense as other songs we had in top 1's but it does the job imo, the build up to the last drop starts at ~65% so that's where the intensity settles in, and since the level is over 3 minutes long it's still over a minute of gameplay left
Who tf is the host, also which silent circles, there's a billion versions and i cant remember which you're even talking about
It sucks because I remember watching the early previews of Avernus, and looking back it's crazy how good it could have been
Exactly lol its so disappointing
imo even after getting 79 atm my enjoyment rating is a 9/10
most fixed hitboxes from an outside perspective may seem really bad but they really (take this from someone who has 79) dont make that big of a difference.
this is just my opinion i think avernus is a really good level even tho the creation process was scuffed and wasnt properly done
Ye I see people complaining how the fixed hitboxes would make it annoying and unnatural to play but it doesn't really matter when you're playing the hardest demon in the game, you'd have already found a way to get consistentat those parts.
@@DiamondGD well your opinion by far is more important than nearly 100% of other players
Atleast we have "Tidal Wave" now that isnt hell theme and its little bit different. I mean its wave based level but deco is unique.
Its still mid
i’m very doubtful that a level with 200k objects is gonna get rated any time soon
Ametrys please save us
@@Powerman47 you're now mid
As TIDAL WAVE is No. 1 demon now
Rejoice
I really agree and I love it when these really true videos come to me. It's a fact that is very sad for all creators that the only thing this community wants is just the same copies of the levels keep uploading everyday, It's common for creators to feel the pressure of trying to do something unique and end up giving in to that community pressure and failing miserably because of it. It's a shame, that even entire servers can hate you just for being or creating something different, not because you want difficulty, or want the best decoration of all. But, just making for your own, promotes creativity and the art of expressing yourself and expressing something you like. But the community isn't like that, it hates you for being different, and until you stop it it won't stop chasing you until the end. But don't give in to them, Don't stop for them, because unfortunately, listening to this part of the community unfortunately becomes a failure, a really bad failure. The only thing we can do is depend on ourselves, because wanting attention from this community will lead you to failure and being ridiculed as the creator of Avernus.
Falou tudo miga (brincadeira)
Facts.
11:48 sounds like tf2 engineer saying nope
yeah
Really amazing video! I like the fact that you went into so much detail elaborating how Avernus was lazy and unfun rather than just outright stating it and ending the video.
i thought this was going to be another video just putting down and bashing in avernus for being bad, but the end of the video really opened my eyes to how the gd community functions and how it needs to change. great video!
It doesnt "need" to change. 2.2 is coming out that will change everything and bring attention away from demons.
@@milanek1527when will 2.2 coming out again?
@@retouru8345 october
@@retouru8345 this month
4 days ago
love the EmpLemon vibes I got from this video (especially the music at 17:55), very well done
I’m really glad we’re seeing a shift in the popularity of GD levels. Gone are the days of Bloodbath and Sonic Wave where the hardest levels get all the attention. Some of the most hype I’ve seen for levels recently have been for impressive non-list levels like Abel, Change of Scene, Floating Outskirts, and most recently Spu7nix’s What. Seriously, if there’s any level that makes me go “…What?” It’s What.
I was away from this community for years and I came back coincidentally when avernus was getting beaten up by the community. My first thought seeing the level with the song and theme is that 'Oh a sequel to GgB0y's infernal abyss' not the golden lmao
The biggest failure as a community is the pressure on Rob to rate levels just because they're difficult. Maybe we would have another layer of quality control for gameplay and decoration/optimization if Rob actually looked at the level like he would look at any other level instead of "oooooh, new top 10 extreme demon". Sadly, I think this is something Rob used to do with levels like Wcropolix, Crimson Planet, and Thinking Space but I think the backlash Rob got for not rating Crimson Planet when it was a top 1 has made it so that he rates nearly any new extreme demon verification. Sakupen Circles and Silent Clubstep are objectively bad levels but they didn't have any trouble getting rated like they might have used to.
The hitboes are pockewindfish's fault. Zoink was forced to buff the level, but everything is on the same layer. insead of ruining the decoration, and preserved it and buffed it by fixing the hitboxes.
"Avernus Represents EVERYTHING WRONG with Geometry Dash"
meanwhile it's actually one of the most enjoyed levels in the top 10
I have played avernus and I guarantee it is unironically good
@@Garvity69420 yeah same 👍
peak demon list (imo) was either with Zodiac as top 1 or with the top 4 being Tartarus, The Golden, Zodiac, Kenos, Crimson Planet. There's something so iconic about those versions of the list and i cant quite put my finger on what it is
Crimson Planet, Bloodlust, and Zodiac for me
"the list was made for levels, now levels are made for the list" is very insightful and really sums up how the community has started putting too much value on difficulty. good vid
Can I just say how well editted this video is. It has perfect consistency with its subjects, makes good points, and overall has amazing editting. You earned a sub!
6:59 “Even after all this time, it never ended up becoming the top 1 that it always strived to be” About that…
how bout now???
your rant on how the community doesnt like unique stuff honestly kinda hits becuase in a way i feel like all my ideas for levels are very derivative, the 2 levels ive spent the most time on are an old slaughterhouse remake and a sonic wave inspired level, both 1.9 styled. it really says something about my creativity that my 2 favorite types of levels are hell levels and circles levels
*Avernus and Acheron have swapped, with Avernus now sitting above at #1.*
Jtard lol
bro had to bold his comment 😭😭🙏🙏🙏🙏
@@flamingzucchini7843 the change log message was also bold?
I feel so lucky for finding a video as good as this one. Huge props for literally everything you did here
He nailed it
thanks for feature
my first level (extreme demon) soon
honestly really excited for my first level, hope it comes out soon 🙏🙏🙏
To think a level like this would represent the GD community as a whole. Thanks so much for making this video. Not only is the effort awesome, but I finally held a full grasp about my personal view on the GD community in general thanks to the many points you created throughout the video! Honestly, I’m even more motivated to keep going as a GD player because of this. Thanks!!! :D
Man, this video is so well made! You really feel like the Emplemon of GD (I realised at 17:56 lmao), because you take a popular topic and put an interesting spin on it that ends up meaning more than the sum of its parts. Keep it up man, you could easily be one of the greats!
i love how all people who say that avernus has bad gameplay aren't able to play it
@@nik0n1ko yeah even some of the victors say its the best level they ever played for a top 3
At this point i take back anything I may have said about zoink and I hold my head in shame. It wasnt his fault, he was INSTRUCTED TO MAKE IT INTO A BAD LEVEL.
Also doesnt matter if you have an RTX 4090 or a GTX 1050 2GB, they will run GD the same, unless the CPU's single core is better (13700K is about 2x faster performance per watt over my old 8700K @95W max)
17:56
We both like Emplemon's editing style huh. (I know the rest of the video has it's own editing style I just liked this moment. I think it was the simpsons, the song, the text popping up to the song, and the light on the individual simpson character)
Already know today's gonna be great when TroyPM uploads! Your videos are always incredible man!
i just can’t believe its still getting a sequel, absolutely abhorrent
Amazing video, i really enjoyed watching this, i totally agree that a level should be something that you enjoy making and that you make for the sake of yourself and the community, not something you make as a chore. just to get some popularity. I think that avernus should have just stayed as a top 20 and shouldnt have been horribly buffed, the level woul have been probably liked a lot more.
(Also, TroyPM Fun Times)
I love this video. It has amazing editing, great pacing, and was the first time I learned about the history of this level (Pockewindfish is an alt account? It was made by half the same creators as “The Golden”?) It doesn’t feel good to be part of a community that allows such problems to persist, but we need to self-reflect to solve them.
I never knew Avernus' layout was first showcased on my birthday lmao
lol
lol
Lol
lol
lol
hot take: avernus is actually amazing and the gameplay is really good
Bro don't know what hot take is
I agree
i expected this to be another rant video that i click off in 2 minutes, but this was actually such a high quality video! the pacing is great, the parts all felt necessary, the history was interesting and felt well-researched, didn't feel extremely biased, overall a fantastic vid
"the list was made for levels,now the levels are made for the list"
WHAT DID Y'ALL EXPECT? People push the limits, that's why levels are made for the list.
fr they all say "oLd bEtTeR nEw bAd" like god damn they are not always bad 😭
For a year now ive been saying this level is blindly haten upon and people have actually started to take notice.
True. Even never gotten into hate train but if I saw someone bad opinion I may believed it and join the blind hate.
Speaking genuinely, this is such a well made video, highlighting everything wrong with a level and explaining i proper detail how it came to be. Looking forward to your future videos.
if the fact of the fixed hitboxes is a problem, then the REAL problem is how INCONSISTENT THE FIXED HITBOXES ARE. like some of them are shifted , making them harder than other spikes! utter cancer
just randomly found this video on my recommended page and thought it was gonna be the same thing the other 50 "why avernus sucks" videos already said, but it actually said some valid points. nice video man! keep it up!
man explains why people should stop getting angry about the square game, then gets angry about the square game
fr
?
no one who can't beat the level can't comment on the gameplay, and no one who cant decorate anywhere close to how well the decorators of the level can, cant comment on the deco
The average enjoyment pf people who have beat it is actually really high.
yeah and these people still feel like they have the say on this, actually pathetic
17:15 I can tell you right now, the youtube presence of GD hasn't been about the best and brightest levels since probably around when sea1997 made a few videos on ToshDeluxe.
1000 languages and this dude decided to speak facts. Incredible video, very well spoken. I don’t think I disagree with a single point here.
I feel ever since slaughter house or spaceuk confessing, the extreme demon list has just deteriorated. I feel like the only people who can revive it now is Riot and all the og creators. Imagine, a level with riot, dorabae, Cody, darned and zobros. It would be sooo iconic.
Eternal:
The demonlist is like the clout-route for players
If you want attention in the gd community, go in another list. Memory levels. 2p levels. Impossible levels. You can change the Geometry dash community!
17:56 Nostalgic Weather Channel Music: “Your current weather condition”
nice chroma key advanced at 0:08
Yo wsp waboo
Nahh 2 likes 💀
how does this have only 9 likes and 2 other comments
@@waboo is the 84th tip of “83 building hacks” or something fixed hitboxes?
You forgot to mension that another reason that avernus is hated is because of Pockewindfish, he has been very controversial because of him insulting and threatening people that dislike the level or saying that it is easier than acheron. Anyway, good video
dude, your editing is very unique, it demostrates the passion that you have with the game and cinematography too, praise to you!!!
ive tried my hardest to like this level for what it is but you just proved to me that Avernus is objectively bad. also really agree with your stance on the community, things really need to change.
also you’re a very underrated creator, i was surprised with the level of quality and editing! keep making videos like this man
It feels like the community is splitting. One side is going to kaiguy’s argument, which has a lot of children, and the other to fnm04’s argument. Passion projects like anathema, hbfs, white space, requiem, etc. still exist and are arguably growing, but also people who just want to make quick profit of stats, money, or whatever, like that yunhaseo guy or kaiguy are too. Its just now the divide is growing stronger, so people are finally beginning to comment on it.
I think bro is so mad abt the deco and the editor layer on avernus that he decided to actually put giygas theme in, im fucking scared
I really do appreciate the ending of the video, we need more commentary videos that helps on a happy note like that
This was a really good video! I thought the editing was really tight and the pacing of the script was phenomenal. Your voiceover of said script was very convincing too, the only reason I assume it was scripted at all is because of the quality. The EmpLemon influence is strong and noticeable, and I think you managed to incorporate elements of his style while remaining unique very well.
troy you are one of the few gd youtubers that actually puts in effort in their content
ong
funny because its true
Funny because it's false
@@lukecarroll19 🤡
name 3 popular gd youtubers who don't put effort into their content
this feels like the numptaloid video about abyss of darkness, and in case you don’t know I bloody love that video, great video mate
It really does lmfao
Just separate the demon list into 3 different columns. Hardest , most enjoyable/fun , and best looking/atmosphere, this way players/creators can vote on each aspect of a demon separately. To take it a step further , you could add a 4th column that takes into account of all 3 rankings, ideally putting more weight on the enjoyment/look on a level instead of its difficulty, giving it a general overview for anyone that wants to play it
Avernus would be 2 in difficulty but will most likely not even crack top 150 on the other 2 columns , thus not even sniffing the top 150 of the overall rating of the level. This way the list is fixed and the community would get an easier overview of which levels they want to play/talk about
Most enjoyable/fun would most likely just be filled with the easiest levels, because they would have the most victors with a positive experience.
@@Conorator not necessarily, some people enjoy the challenge and get some fun out of it , but some levels have atrocious gameplay making it harder than it has to be.
@@okaydt8713 I'm saying that easier levels would have more victors *overall,* meaning that they would have more people saying they're fun.
@@Conorator ahhh i got you , i feel like that’s perfectly fine tho
He started so calm and then he went crazy mad lol.
Bro's upload made my day 10x better
I could easily write a whole essay on why comments like these are ruining RUclips and why people should start noticing this issue more.
@@averagelizard2489 honestly im extremely curious to why you think comments like mine is ruining youtube
Tidal wave is basically what happened with avernus but worse, so bad that the level didn't even get rated. I don't know what happened but I truly love that level, seems like the community doesn't.
I love the fact that you dont talk about just the level itself but the problems this comunity has
this video has my thoughts exactly, especially the stuff about how people like kaiguy and creators of all these extreme demons made to be impossibly hard are just doing it for attention and its making the community worse as a whole
a correction: they did use the creator contest part but not the winner, they used the second place
what
why
@@apastelnerd because it fits more with the rest of the level and looks better
LETS GO! YOU PASSED ME IN SUBS! I remember you had almost 2k, and now you have almost 4k! Keep it up man, you're doing amazing
does this explain why the 3 victors of the level had not a bad rating on the enjoyment??
great video, id just like to add something. iirc doggie never dropped avernus, he literally had no idea as to what was happening with it up until when zoink said that he was verifying it. this means that the hosts basically stole the level from doggie after a full year of him expecting to verify it
11:56 he literally turned into a demon LOL
Ok I know this is random but the "nope" at 11:49 sounds SO MUCH like the TF2 Engineer's "nope"
My favorite part about the demons is when you can't play it because it's an epileptic hazard, just for the layout to be on xStep level of difficulty
This comment was made before WANNACRY was released, I believe. *THE GIFT OF PROPHECY*
@@RadanoxIspy is also at semi-fault lol
You are the far less passive aggressive version of Stormfly, and you have my utmost respect for that. Amazing analysis video. You're true about the fact that the complete lack of originality and charm is the true reason why Avernus is a complete dumpsterfire.
About the lags - GPU doesn't really affect the game. If you have an i5-13900 and like some geforce 210, it will most likely be enough for you to run something around Limbo objects count just fine. The GPU is just not used by the game, all calculations are done by one thread of CPU. That's why people say about poor game optimization.
the demon list is everything that's wrong with gd to begin with
If you want to know how bad the problem of Identity is on Avernus
I mistaked this as a sequel to Infernal Abyss.
I've been in this community for a long time and I find it funny how the mentality shifted, people used to long for a top 1 that lasted without victors for as long as Bloodbath did, now it's happening and people don't like it, isn't that exactly what yall wanted?
It's all in the presentation nowadays, bloodbath felt epic and like an entire community's efforts towards the completion of a single level, avernus feels like just another red top 1 verified in a week
funny tho that like every victor has enjoyed the level tho. i dont get why people talk about a levels gameplay when they arent good enough to play it. the levels clearly doing something right if all victors enjoyed it
exactly. i was surprised to see such high enjoyment ratings on just about every victor's video
I originally liked the Avernus design because even though it looks messy, but it is messy throughout the whole level. But...
11:50
Having a whole part in a single layer is stupid like who would do that
Recent tab creators would most certainly do that
Good stuff! Really accurate and entertainig video. I just want to say some things:
The demonlist doesn't really deserve any bit of hate, their job is just ranking the thardest rated demons in the servers, no matter quality, no matter how bad, unfair dogshit is, if it was legit verified and rated, it would be placed.
About of the Avernus deco, i don't think is that bad, even if i don't like it that much i think it's really good, it's just really risky. Take in mind this is a HELL THEMED LEVEL, it looks unique aff taking in mind Avernus theme. It's really atmospheric and as a The Golden's antagonist, is really well executed.
Keep up the good work! :]
I liked avernus deco a decent bit, and specially the fireballs and dragon shadow
Guys gameplay wise there's also Silent Clubstep. The level looks cool but there are too many fixed hitboxes. Its not like any of us can pass the first jump 99% of the time in the top 10 demons either.
Diamond just became the first Avernus victor!!!
9:02 everybody gangsta until 2 player levels start popping up
you are one of the most articulate, reasonable, passionate speakers i've ever seen in this game's community. i'm a veteran player, i've been playing since i first downloaded the game on my ipod touch in late 1.9. i've watched this game grow from a place where creativity was valued to a place where constantly-inflating rate standards and an increasingly toxic, entitled community have condensed this game from a beautiful, fun, artistic community into "iSpyWithMyLittleEye VS Change Of Scene 5 LEVELS OF DIFFICULTY $10000 #shorts". in fact, i recently conducted an experiment to see if a shitpost youtube short could get attention immediately just by featuring GD, and it did. avernus is simply a benchmark of a deep poison within this playerbase, and here's hoping that 2.2 will return us to our wide-eyed curiosity and awkward implementations of new update features like back in 2.0
finally, avernus has been kicked out of its top 1 spot by a 69x better level (tidal wave)
avernus is way better than tidal wave
I love that people call this level bland and constantly call to mind the fixed hitboxes..
Does that not describe Tartarus? There are so many top demons that were lazily made, little to no effort. I think the level looks good. The hate it receives is truly unjust in my opinion. I don't understand what everyone has against it.
People love to bandwagon and hate on something everyone else hates
i cant say anything about avernus, but tartarus doesnt have any sections that are made less fun because of the fixed hitboxes. Also its in like three spots, the entire predrop on avernus is fixed.
@@laarman. womp womp this comment is old
@@cheery0163 um... two weeks old...
@@laarman. old enough to the point where it's no longer relevant to me in my daily life. I'm no longer open to disputes
This video went from "this level sucks" to "frick the demon list" to "this is the worst game community" to "I actually wish we liked this level" back to "this level sucks"
20 mins of angry troy
I used to be part of the gd community, the obsession with top one's and challenges just got boring, also the gatekeeping too, people think if your hardest isn't top 100 or something, you're bad.